I can’t believe the guy who originally administered the creation of Twitter would do all the exact same things that originally made him billions of dollars selling the company to Elon Musk.
There’s no way he’s just speed-running what he did last time in hopes of another $44B buyout.
Figured they would go down this route. Don’t use it anyway
The checkmark is the wrong approach. You should never trust accounts, because accounts get hacked. We should instead use cryptographic signatures on individual posts, and clients can warn when that signature doesn’t match the account’s public key, or if that key changed recently. The private key would never live on the server, and ideally live outside the app.
This doesn’t verify identity, it just proves the key didn’t change. To establish identity, the person needs to use the same key in multiple places, such as posting it on a personal website or something. If a service wants to add their own stamp of approval, they can sign these public keys and embed them into the apl for clients to use (e.g. show a blue checkmark if Bluesky can verify the public key outside its system).
If the private key is compromised, repeat the process, potentially signing the new key with both the old and new key to prove control of both (or start from scratch if needed). Repeat whenever they get hacked.
Average user:
“Wait how do I get cryptocurrency with my key?”
This is a great idea.
It’s also not new. GPG has been around for decades, and is pretty much this.
you don’t kill a cow for a scratch on her leg (I hope the saying is understandable for everybody since it doesn’t come from English).
I’m on mastodon and bluesky: the first is even less populated than here and a big part of the interesting content comes from bot reposting popular accounts from x or reddit, while the second is far from being THE solution but it’s nowadays a -not wildly populated- compromise. I don’t condone (while I understand) the Turkish bans and I’m not interested in a verification system: if I’d like one, I’d use https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EIDAS.
I hope bluesky will correct its approach for what they can (the “good old” twitterin the golden era was banned in Turkey)I believe the equivalent saying would be “don’t let perfect be the enemy of good”.
I couldn’t give a single shit about these twitter alternatives, because the whole concept is stupid.
the whole concept is stupid.
+1
Being that algorithmic just makes any Twitter-like design too easy to abuse.
Again, Lemmy (and Reddit) is far from perfect, but fundamentally, grouping posts and feeds by niche is way better. It incentivizes little communities that are concerned about their own health, while users have zero control over that shouting into the Twitter maw.
yea lemmy/reddit definitely seems like more of a sweet spot. with twitter/mastodon or anything that has a “say something” text box right in your face on every page, you are going to end up with a lot of noise, because most people just dont have interesting things to say most of the time
I don’t understand - do you think mastodon (or the fediverse in general) is sparsely populated? That’s not my impression at all!
That’s exactly what I meant: very few people, only on main niches, and some political and lifestyle ideas are common to 90% of the userbase (ie: anti-Trump, pro-Palestine, pro-Foss, etc).
I’m not complaining, just reporting what I seeIt seems that you don’t curate your followers much and/or don’t follow many people. The timeline is what you make it to be by following a variety of people as there isn’t an algoritm to curate it for you. There’s plenty of interesting content circling around and it’s wholly up to you wether it makes it to your timeline or not.
I get it, but I don’t want to curate my followers, I’m not a news media, I just follow users I totally like, I usually look for content I don’t see in my timeline, do a lot of surfing, but in the end it’s not that big as today
If they really, really want to fix 99.8% of the problems with hate speech (and many other issues), each user needs to agree to have their real name, home address, email address, and phone number available to the public, in their profile. While what I’ve just said is completely absurd, for almost everyone, it’s the anonymity that empowers people to say the absolute worst things.
Why don’t most people in the checkout line (queue) at the grocery store act the same way they do in a traffic jam on a roadway? Because they’re much more likely to be held personally accountable for their conduct. I wonder how much traffic would change, if our name, address and telephone numbers were required to be posted on all sides of our vehicles?
it’s the anonymity that empowers people to say the absolute worst things.
humans behave badly when they perceive they have social license to do so. anonymity has little to do with it
- exhibit A: public robberies of German Jews in the 1930s
- exhibit B: rwandan genocide
- exhibit C: any public confrontation video shot during the Covid pandemic
your second paragraph makes you sound like Larry Ellison. all you’re arguing for is the extension of the capacity of corporations to constrain and coerce invidiual behaviour, which is gross
I didn’t read what you said but I like it, everyone gets a license plate on bluesky.
ARE WE LEARNING HOW “SOCIAL MEDIA” WORKS YET HUMANITY?
Seriously. How many more fucking times do we need to go around this goddamn merry go round until we just start calling each other on the phone and meeting face to face again. You know, where the only enshittification is the one you bring with you. It’s fucking boring me now, how many of these stupid ass things I didn’t join because I’ve already, apparently, gotten the memo and how, inevitably, something like this happens, and everyone acts surprised and disappointed , as though inevitability was a concept they felt they’d been given a sabbatical from or something.
This. Shit. Ain’t. Free. There is an inherent cost, an “effort” required to communicate with others. You pay it with money, time or privacy. The overwhelming choice lately has been “privacy”, but it’s obviously something that not everyone is comfortable with, because we didn’t have the term “enshittification” before we started this flavor of our collective idiocy.
ARE WE LEARNING HOW “SOCIAL MEDIA” WORKS YET HUMANITY?
Apparently not, because people keep feeling surprised and offended when the Networking Effect happens.
Seriously. How many more fucking times do we need to go around this goddamn merry go round until we just start calling each other on the phone and meeting face to face again
Idk, when are we going to get low-cost public transit and VoIP that’s not like talking over two tin cans connected with string?
What is this networking effect you mentioned? I tried searching online but I think I’m missing the context needed to find the right info.
Networking Effect
Thanks for the link. That’s what I found, so I’m certain I’m missing something. Can you clue me in on why people are getting surprised and offended by it?
Can I subscribe to your social media accounts? I would like to follow your opinions.
Nah, for real though, I’m so glad my best friend is still fairly analog and we use the phone for what it is (we just call each other when we want to meet up).
Lemmy is the last of social media that I use and I regularly take breaks from it because the echo chamber is very apparent and not something I wish to be consumed by.
Yeah I deleted my Bluesky. All public companies eventually turn to shit because of the shareholders unending greed.
Then come over to Mastodon…
Bluesky is the new X. After canceling the accounts of Turkish protesters this is the next step for the big money behind Bluesky. That’s why I deleted my account a few days ago.
What’s the story with the Turkish protesters?
The way the article describes Turkey and the press is the same thing that’s been happening in the US with the legacy (state funded) media. Hopefully, that’s changing now though.
Bluesky has basically bowed to the Turkish regime: https://www.turkishminute.com/2025/04/17/bluesky-restrict-access-72-account-turk-amid-government-pressure/
Exactly, Bluesky has been shitty for a while for lots of reasons. I’m not understanding why this is the line in the sand.
Same. Deleted my account when they started to censor the Turkish protestors. Not that I used the account really but still.
No one disliked the check mark before “Genghis Kunt” started selling it
It was selectively given to institutions and “major” celebrities before that.
Selling them dilutes any meaning of “verified” because any joe can just pay for extra engagement. It’s a perverse incentive, as the people most interest in grabbing attention buy it and get amplified.
It really has little to do with Musk.
this is unnecessary with custom domains
Their position is that custom domains are “too hard.”
Any system built on anonymous accounts is going to have the exact same problems. Lemmy is not “less bad” than Reddit because it’s decentralized. Blue checks isn’t the problem with twitter, and neither is Elong
Not sure where you’re going with that, but it’s a perverse incentive, just like the engagement algorithm.
Elon is a problem because he can literally force himself into everyone’s feeds, but also because he always posts polarizing/enraging things these days.
Healthy social media design/UI is all about incentivizing good, healthy communities and posts. Lemmy is not perfect, but simply not designing for engagement/profit because Lemmy is “self hosted” instead of commercial is massive.
mastodon exists
Bluesky, the decentralized social network […]
Were only one instance exist or did I miss something?
As I understand it, the protocol has the ability to decentralize built in. But the technical requirements are prohibitively high to the point only large businesses or corps could afford to do it. I also believe (someone correct me) the company hasn’t switched on the functionality yet.
Last heard (a few months ago) the cost is in storage. The protocol isn’t too complicated now, but it generates a shit ton of data, and IIRC you need a minimum of 3 copies.
Storage is cheap whwn it comes to webhosting and 3 replicas is honestly not much when it comes to enterprise standards. I think cloud storage providers like backblaze keep something like 9 copies of data across different mediums
The biggest thing is that you need to be manually authorized by them for federation. They will only ever federate with servers that arent serious enough competition to lead to democratization of the overall network.
No, PDS federation is fully open now.
They’re also actively supporting development of 3rd party appviews and relays.
The power dynamic is still 1000000:1 they can do whatever they want and you will have to follow. If they defederate you, there is no value in your self hosted instance.
I think their initial selling point was that Eventually©®™ Bluesky would federate with the rest of the Fediverse.
Is anybody really surprised that a social media corporation didn’t make it their utmost priority to allow their userbase to connect out of their proprietary platform?
They never said they’d do so natively with other protocols - but they support Bridgy, so you already can do that.
Nope, it’s 100% centralized.
It’s 100% centralized, but with the ability to be decentralized. Sorta like Threads before they started federating
The “ability” to decentralize has costs that scale quadratically. So in every practical sense, it cannot be decentralized. At best it could have a few servers that participate.
No, it doesn’t scale “quadratically”. That’s what going viral on Mastodon does to a small instance, not on bluesky. Pretty much everything scales linearly. The difference is certain components handle a larger fraction of the work (appview and relay).
Both a bluesky appview and a Mastodon instance scales by the size of the userbase which it interacts with. Mastodon likes to imagine that the userbase will always be consistent, but it isn’t. Anything viewed by a large part of the whole Mastodon network forces the host to serve the entirety of the network and all its interactions. So does a bluesky appview, in just the same way, but they acknowledge this upfront.
Meanwhile, you CAN host a bluesky PDS account host and have your traffic scale only by the rate of your users’ activity + number of relays you push these updates to. Going viral doesn’t kill your bandwidth.
I can’t speak to how traffic costs and mastodon works, but this article explains how having multiple blue skies federating with each other scales quadratically. https://dustycloud.org/blog/how-decentralized-is-bluesky/ it is very thorough.
In fact, it is worse than the storage requirements, because the message delivery requirements become quadratic at the scale of full decentralization: to send a message to one user is to send a message to all. Rather than writing one letter, a copy of that letter must be made and delivered to every person on earth
That’s written assuming the edge case of EVERYBODY running a full relay and appview, and that’s not per-node scaling cost but global scaling cost.
Because they don’t scale like that, global cost is geometric instead (for every full relay and appview, there’s one full copy with linear scaling to network activity), and each server only handles the cost for serving their own users’ activity (plus firehose/jetstream subscription & filtering for those who need it)
For Mastodon instance costs, try ask the former maintainers of https://botsin.space/
Preaching to the choir
But anyway anyone who thinks bluesky is actually decentralised will learn sooner rather than later that that’s not the case
